"It is important that AI creates masterpieces, but does not kill the human gift"
Artificial intelligence has become a cross-cutting topic of the sessions of the XII St. Petersburg International Forum of United Cultures, which is taking place these days in the Northern Capital. According to the Russian Minister of Culture, technology should not kill human talent and talent. ""Olga Lyubimova spoke in an exclusive interview with Izvestia about the balance between the use of AI and the rights of creators of works of art, as well as about the closure of the Russian House in Berlin, active international cooperation and theater education.
""I believe that life will return to the Russian House in Berlin"
— Culture is one of the main channels of international dialogue. Which countries are showing the greatest interest in Russia and where do you see prospects for cooperation?
— The term "cancellation culture" is even meaningless to mention. We have been closely following the attempts to abolish Russian culture in the world for four years and realized that this is impossible. Despite all the loud statements, the names of our great compatriots, both composers and artists, are heard abroad. These connections are horizontal, and they persist. Major music producers still organize private events and host our artists in different countries. And we are glad that people all over the world who appreciate Russian culture have the opportunity to meet their favorite composers and performers.
I am pleased to note that last year Russian performers visited 40 countries. These are official tours and major exhibition projects. First of all, of course, we are talking about our friends and colleagues from the CIS countries. These events are conducted with extreme care. We take into account security issues and difficulties with flights. They are related not only to restrictions on Russia, but also, for example, to the situation in the Persian Gulf region. We keep a close eye on the situation, but nevertheless we give our friends the opportunity to meet their favorite performers and enjoy joint cultural projects.
— You said that it is impossible to abolish Russian culture. Nevertheless, the Russian House was recently closed in Berlin. How can we maintain the presence of our culture in Europe, both for its foreign fans and for our citizens who live there?
— The Russian House in Berlin was really an incredible place. I remember him not so much as the Minister of Culture, but as your colleague, a journalist. This is a real point of attraction, where many wonderful events took place. I believe that life will return to the Russian House in Berlin.
There were a lot of educational and educational projects, including for the youngest. Elderly people came there, who could attend a wonderful concert for free, meet compatriots and communicate in their native language. The Russian House opened its doors to all comers without checking the passports of visitors, and introduced them to the best examples of our art and educational projects.
It is very important to us that, no matter what, even in European countries that are so noisy with their anti-Russian agenda, there are professional producers who privately organize Russian events. We try not to advertise or emphasize their activities once again, so as not to create additional obstacles in this area.
To a greater extent, when you hear this kind of news, you realize that it is aimed at anti-Russian PR. Therefore, in those countries where we have the opportunity to bring our projects, we try to do it for viewers who love our country and our culture.
"The bilateral year of Cultural Exchange between Russia and China allowed us to hold 430 events"
— Relations with China are actively developing: joint film production, theater and exhibition projects. Can you tell us what has already been achieved and what prospects open up in further cultural cooperation?
— It's a pleasure to answer this question. Let's start with education. Talented Chinese students study choreography and music at our creative universities. This is due not only to quotas, but also to the work of our colleagues from Rossotrudnichestvo, who provide an opportunity to study at our leading universities.
If we talk about touring, of course, we are working with our colleagues from the Chinese Ministry of Culture. There are a lot of joint projects and major tours. In this country, they love not only our musical theaters, but also dramatic ones. And we are especially pleased to note that a separate life continues at the largest theater venues and the oldest repertory theaters, such as, for example, the Bolshoi Drama Theater.
Private Chinese producers make elaborate tours of different provinces of the country to present the best Russian performances, concerts and ballets. And we are always very pleased when our colleagues at the highest level emphasize the value of such close cooperation during bilateral meetings. When, for example, Maestro Gergiev comes on tour, all the websites selling tickets for his performance go down. This was mentioned by the country's leadership in their theses. Of course, this is both a compliment and an incentive for us to continue working.
The bilateral year of cultural exchange between Russia and China allowed us to hold 430 events in a wide variety of areas. The Ilya Repin exhibition was a triumphant success. It is a joint project of the Russian Museum, the St. Petersburg Academy of Arts and the Tretyakov Gallery. Who was its initiator? Xi Jinping. He was the first to mention that he was a big fan of the great master and would be happy to see his work at the National Gallery in Beijing. Such large-scale projects are always bilateral. The Tretyakov Gallery later also hosted their museums. There are a lot of plans ahead and very different requests from Chinese colleagues who are sensitive and knowledgeable.
"It is important to soberly assess whether a young person really needs to become an artist"
— Let's move on from international cooperation to domestic issues. Ticket prices. The theater community is increasingly recalling Konstantin Stanislavsky's testament of a public theater. Tell me, is it possible to influence this situation? Are there any mechanisms, benefits, or special programs?
— There are no more than 10-15 really notable and resonant productions in our country, which every avid theater-goer considers a must-see. This is used by ticket resellers — that's what our department is fighting in the first place. The audience accuses both the management of the theater and, as a result, the founder, the relevant department, of high prices. Therefore, we are monitoring the situation very seriously.
Moscow theaters have switched to a ticket sales system based on passports, which prevents resellers from inflating prices. In St. Petersburg, there is also such a restriction on several performances at the Bolshoi Drama Theater. In turn, we ensure that prices remain affordable.
Today, the demand for going to the theater is enormous! I was on a business trip to Orel recently and asked the governor, "What are the main issues?" He says, "The main problem is in the drama theater. The tickets are sold out four months in advance." I think: what a wonderful problem! (He smiles). After all, we perfectly remember how recently these tickets were given to state employees and distributed according to certain programs. Now the situation is completely different. You arrive in Vladimir, and the director of the local drama theater says with burning eyes: "Three months, everything is sold out, we are already preparing for the New Year!" And there is so much excitement in this! We make sure that this excitement is healthy and the theater remains accessible.
Of course, we pay special attention to the families of ITS participants and veterans. We are carrying out this work with the "Defenders of the Fatherland" Foundation so that these people can get to even the most notable and sought-after productions.
— Including during the New Year's season, when demand is particularly high?
— You've probably heard what happened in Moscow with the "Nutcracker" on New Year's Eve: every time there was a terrible queue, and some very strange theater fans in tracksuits were standing in it from five in the morning. And then tickets appeared at incredible prices, which caused public discontent.
So, maestro Valery Abisalovich Gergiev changed his position. First of all, tickets for the "Nutcracker" are now available only with passports. Secondly, there are more targeted performances, where the participants of the SVO and their families, teachers, and the best students of creative universities are invited, who could not even imagine that they would be able to get to the Bolshoi during the New Year holidays. We are carrying out this work so that, on the one hand, theaters remain in demand, and on the other, so that people have more opportunities.
— Let's look at the theater from the other side — from the point of view of personnel training. Hundreds of young professionals graduate in the country every year, but the industry cannot provide jobs for everyone. To what extent does the Ministry of Culture assess the real need for such a large number of creative workers?
— Let's dot the "I". There are 51 federal universities, seven of them theater ones — the oldest, legendary ones, where the same 52 people are going to enroll. If we talk about the demand for graduates of federal theater universities, the situation here is completely different: 83% are then employed by profession. All this is being monitored in order to understand the real needs of the industry and, on this basis, determine the admission control figures for the following years.
Acting and directing are very popular areas. But the choice of profession is strongly influenced by social networks, where everyone sees these rapid ups and downs — the stories of guys who came from the regions to Moscow, and four years later achieved success. But you understand that this is usually one case in a million. And it's always been that way.
Therefore, it is very important for us to pay attention to the choice of a place of study, and to the abundance of private institutions. When it comes to paid education, and this is a family decision, it is important to soberly assess whether a young person really needs to become an artist, whether he understands well what awaits him. We often discuss this with our parents — my colleagues, employees of the Ministry of Culture, rectors of theater schools, and the teaching staff.
Yes, there are four years of absolute happiness ahead. Can you imagine what it's like to study at a theater college? It's a romance, a legend. We read with interest the memoirs of famous, accomplished artists about their student days and forget that we don't know how those whose careers didn't work out studied. How does it feel when you're not the best of the best, when you don't have that gift? Sometimes it's a shame that the desire of a family to give a beloved child a dream is a sea of tears and the inability to work in a profession.
I think it's worth paying serious attention to this. Parents need to have a good understanding of where their child is going and why, and whether it makes sense to invest money, effort, and time in it. Especially when it comes to an institution that has just received a license and promises a bright future, but definitely cannot guarantee it.
"Before the advent of artificial intelligence, the copyright system was clear and well-established"
— We are at the United Cultures Forum in St. Petersburg. Who are we meeting here these days?
— Participants from 70 countries gathered in St. Petersburg. More than 40 official delegations are employees of the Ministries of Culture and my ministerial colleagues. The signing of joint agreements and bilateral meetings on the organization of cultural events are ahead, as well as the discussion of work prospects for three, four or five years ahead.
We are glad that representatives of seven major international cultural organizations have gathered here. This proves that the interaction process has not been interrupted. We have the opportunity to hear from each other, share experiences, and learn alternative points of view.
Our outstanding artists speak at various panel discussions, each in his own field: theater, cinema, museum business, contemporary art, creative education. Also, artificial intelligence — what about now without it? (He smiles). AI is a cross—cutting topic of literally every session of the St. Petersburg Forum of United Cultures.
— The United Cultures Forum discusses the impact of AI on art. One of the main issues is copyright: should creators be rewarded for using their works to train neural networks, or should they be able to prohibit it?
— We have all witnessed the first scandals related to the use of intellectual property objects: with the help of promptos, new works are created, most often musical, which become popular, but raise questions from copyright holders.
Before the advent of artificial intelligence, the copyright system was clear and well-established: legislation defined the rules of interaction. Today, in addition to ethical issues, technological issues also arise — for example, how to determine the degree of AI involvement in the creation of an audiovisual work.
I'll give you a simple example — an author's animation contest at the Ministry of Culture. It is enough to recall our great masters, for example, the brilliant artist Petrov: for years, unique works of art have been created, funded by the state. Probably, it's still not fair, economically, psychologically, or ideologically, to equally approach government support for a person who drives a line of an industrial product and an artist who creates a masterpiece within five years. These are two completely different works.
Now this is really a very resonant topic, labeling is being discussed. Sometimes you watch strange, improbable videos and you can't believe your own eyes anymore — you can't tell if it's artificial intelligence or not. This is a challenge for the relevant department, the Ministry of Digital Affairs, and everyone involved in audiovisual production.
At the same time, it is wrong to assume that the Ministry of Culture exists separately, outside of this issue and the general discussion. Do you remember how digitalization saved our industry in covid: We began digitizing lectures and got the opportunity to preserve the fantastic legacy of our professorship. The theater is already being filmed with the help of sophisticated technologies, and productions are preserved for many years.
We are already used to technology. And now it is important for us to tame artificial intelligence: to make it create masterpieces, but at the same time not kill the human gift and talent.
— How do you assess the position of the authors who advocate for the protection of their rights when using AI? Have you formed your own position on this issue?
— Of course, I am always on the side of the copyright holder. There is an artist who created the work, there is a composer who wrote the music, and their work should be treated with respect. It is important not only to regulate work with man-made works, but also to ensure fair compensation for this work. I would not like, for example, the golden collection of "Soyuzmultfilm" to become the basis for new works without the consent of the copyright holders, as well as the works of authors such as Vyacheslav Kotenochkin or Fyodor Khitruk. It is necessary to find a balance, and such issues should also be discussed at the United Cultures Forum.
We were working on the material: Valeria Chub, Zoya Igumnova, Ivetta Nevinnaya, Roman Ishmukhametov, Kristina Sokolovskaya
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