"It's easier for me with predators than with officials"
The main fear of the director of the Bolshoi Moscow Circus, People's Artist of Russia Edgard Zapashny is to live his life in vain. This is what makes him set new records every day, push for the construction of a new Bolshoi Moscow Circus, return Russian circus art to the world stage and argue with officials. In an interview with Izvestia on the eve of his 50th birthday, Edgard Zapashny told why it is easier for him with predators than with people, why he goes to the title of master of sports in bench press and why he dreams of a polar bear.
"The President has repeatedly spoken about the circus in his speeches"
— We are talking on the eve of your 50th birthday. Many people are especially sensitive to such dates. With what thoughts do you approach this milestone?
— To be honest, none. I actually feel like I'm being obligated to celebrate an anniversary. I'm not in favor of drawing attention to myself with dates. Throughout my life, I try to be noticed in a good way because of my deeds. And the anniversary... Given the circumstances surrounding my marriage, I have absolutely no desire to have a big feast, celebration, and fun. It's holding me back a lot.
Edgard Zapashny
But friends, family, and colleagues, on the contrary, convince us that we still need a holiday. We decided to celebrate the anniversary in a light way. My brother Askold came up with the idea to make a performance "Very big", timed to coincide with two dates at once: my 50th birthday and the 55th anniversary of the Great Moscow Circus.
— The anniversary is also an occasion to take stock. You have been running the Bolshoi Moscow Circus for almost 14 years. What do you consider the main achievements of this time?
— First of all, I am happy that I have been its director for many years. My brother and I lead a team that, in my opinion, works in the best circus in the world. And I'm saying this quite consciously. Wonderful people work here, who are sincerely in love with the circus and have devoted their whole lives to it. There are employees who worked long before I joined, there are those who came with me or after my appointment. They are all great professionals. It is a great honor for me to lead such a team.
The main thing is that we have significantly increased the prestige of the Bolshoi Moscow Circus. Today, he is already at a completely different level of recognition both in Russia and abroad.
The second important achievement is that the circus has finally come to the attention of government decision makers. The President has repeatedly spoken about the circus in his speeches. There was practically no such thing before. I don't recall Boris Yeltsin saying the word "circus" at all, except during the presentation of state awards. Now the situation has changed.
— At the same time, today it is impossible not to talk about the culture of cancellation. Russian artists have faced serious limitations in theater, opera, and classical music. How much has it affected the circus?
— Unfortunately, it also affected us. We had serious problems with a number of foreign partners, first of all with the International Circus Festival in Monte Carlo, which was one of the first to refuse to cooperate with Russia. There are other European circuses that have unilaterally terminated existing contracts.
The 16th International Circus Festival
At least someone called, explained the situation, and apologized. It is clear that serious political pressure was exerted on many. We treated such people with understanding. But the organizers of the Monte Carlo festival preferred to simply break off the relationship without even explaining themselves. Therefore, a rather fierce information confrontation has arisen between us. We didn't appreciate this attitude as a human being.
However, there are also positive examples. The International Circus Festival in Spain has already invited our artists. We continue to actively cooperate with China, Mongolia, the Democratic People's Republic of Korea and Kazakhstan. We are now starting to work together with Hungary. Recently, the directors of the Hungarian and Paris circuses visited us. The situation remains difficult, but it is far from clear. Politics, of course, affects both culture and circus art, but professional connections remain.
"The modern viewer is used to a different level of comfort"
— What is happening now with the project of the new building of the Great Moscow Circus?
— This question should probably be addressed to the Department of Culture and the Moscow Department of Construction. They are responsible for the construction. We know where the site is, and we see that the area has already been fenced, equipment is working, and preparatory work has begun. But it is difficult for me to say now whether the deadlines will be postponed depending on various circumstances related to CBO. Therefore, I would not like to make any specific promises.
— Yuri Nikulin recalled that when the new circus was being built on Tsvetnoy Boulevard, he was very worried about whether it would be possible to save his soul. Do you have any similar concerns?
- no. We are not talking about moving the old circus to a new location, but about creating a completely new cultural facility. It will be another circus in Moscow. I don't see any point in trying to transfer some mythical soul from one building to another. It will be a completely independent venue that will surpass many world arenas in its capabilities. It seems to me that a new star should be born, not a copy of the old one.
But what to do with the current building of the Bolshoi Moscow Circus is a really important question. Then it will be possible to talk about preserving the history, atmosphere, and memory of this place. But we haven't come to this conversation yet.
— What is more difficult for you today: to enter a predator's cage or convince officials to make the right decision?
— No matter how cynical it may sound, but it's easier for me with predators than with officials. I enjoy working with animals, even relaxing. All the rules have been clear for a long time. I know their language, I understand their behavior, and they are completely honest in their emotions.
But when you get to know someone who has just been appointed, and he has never been to the circus for the last time, this leads to certain difficulties. I fully share the position of our great Nikita Sergeevich Mikhalkov, who recently said at a meeting of the State Council that cinema should be developed by people from the industry.
After all, we have a profession of an official. Such a person can be put in charge of almost any field. Today he works here, tomorrow he works in a completely different industry. But culture is a very complex organism with a subtle internal organization. It needs to be understood. You need to dive into it. We have already gone through this in the Rosgoscirk system, when several general directors in a row never engaged in the circus at all. As a result, they brought the company to a loss of 1.5 billion. Now, fortunately, the situation has stabilized.
Of course, there are excellent managers who really support the circus. I'll give you an example of the Pushkin Map. I had to address the president twice and explain why the circus must be included in this program. After the first conversation, someone managed to convince Vladimir Vladimirovich that the circus should not be included there. But I was sure I was right, and after a while I raised the issue again. For the second time, the president heard me. Probably, my perseverance also played a role. Apparently, he had already delved deeper into the topic himself and did not go along with those who tried to exclude us from this program.
— If you were offered to solve one of the main problems of the Russian circus in the coming years, what would you call it?
— In the first place, I would put the state of the property complex throughout the country. We have circuses that have already been mothballed. The situation in Krasnodar, Penza, and Ufa is very difficult. There are other cities where buildings continue to operate, but when you go there, you realize that Nikita Sergeevich Khrushchev was still sitting on these chairs, under these chandeliers.
The modern viewer is used to a different level of comfort. If a person comes to a gym where everything looks the same as 50 years ago, they probably won't come a second time. Especially if the child has to go to the toilet, which was last repaired in the 1970s.
Unfortunately, this is a problem for many regional circuses. Therefore, a large state program is needed, both for major repairs of buildings and for the reconstruction of dormitories for artists. It should be understood that circus performers come to cities with their families, often with young children. They live there for a month or two, so the living conditions are of great importance.
"And I still believe in the Terminator"
— Today, many cultural figures say that they have to compete with gadgets and short videos for the attention of children. Does the circus feel this competition?
— Yes and no. Of course, we all live in a world where gadgets are gradually consuming humans. I sometimes catch myself on the phone sending a report: you spent too much time in front of the screen this week. And I realize that the virtual world in my life is becoming too much. This is wrong.
If an adult becomes a victim of such addiction, then it is even more difficult for a child. For him, the Internet is indeed full of much greater temptations. But why did I say yes and no? Our Idol show is on every day now. When the lights go out completely in the hall, what should I see? If the audience were on their phones, the whole room would be lit up with screens. But there is no such thing. In 3,300 seats, I see only a few glowing phones. And that makes me very happy.
It seems to me that fatigue is gradually coming from both gadgets and AI. In general, I am convinced that the more artificial there is around us, the more people will begin to appreciate real human work. Even the Internet is slowly starting to disappoint. Today you watch a video where a man hugs a lion or a tiger, and the first thought is no longer admiration, but a question: is this real or a neural network? As a result, it just becomes uninteresting. We used to send similar videos to each other instantly. Now you're already thinking: what if it's a fake? And you don't send it.
— At the same time, the government, on the contrary, is actively investing in the development of domestic AI programs. To what extent can such technologies be useful to the circus?
— Artificial intelligence may well be useful. After all, the circus is not just about working in the arena. It's also the light, the sound, the set design, the staging of the show. If modern technology allows you to create a new project faster or cheaper, as a director, of course, I will use it.
But AI should not completely replace humans. Human labor cannot be devalued. After all, neural networks develop only because they rely on a huge knowledge base created by humans. They use the results of our work anyway. And human thought will always remain unpredictable. And one last thing: I still believe in the Terminator.
— Are you afraid of a machine uprising?
"I wouldn't say I'm afraid. Rather, I believe that such a possibility cannot be ruled out. I recently talked to employees of one of the largest banks and gave them a simple example. I came to the bar, handed over two thousand rubles in cash, and they answered me: "I don't have any change. There just isn't that much cash in the cash register."
And then I asked the bank employees: imagine that one day everyone gets a message at the same time: "You have zero rubles in your account." Let's say some very smart guy, sitting at home, launches a virus into the banking system.
What then? We come to the bank, and they tell us: "Everything has gone to zero for us too." How are we going to live on? Today, we have entrusted our lives to computers so much that we are becoming addicted to them. We ourselves are gradually getting rid of all material things. There will be no cash or any physical evidence.
And if such technologies turn out to be also related to the military sphere, and artificial intelligence begins to make decisions on its own related to the use of weapons, then this is a real "Terminator". I fully admit this possibility. An uncontrolled launch of some kind of strategic weapon - and the consequences can be disastrous.
"I'm most afraid of wasting my life"
— Are there any things that you are really afraid of?
— I don't have any obsessive fears or phobias. I generally try to look at life quite realistically. Of course, like any normal person, I'm afraid that something might happen to my family, friends, and loved ones. And to be honest, I'm most afraid of living my life in vain. I probably haven't lived it anymore, though.
I really don't want someone to say to me at the end, "Why were you on this planet at all? What useful things have you done not only for yourself?" It's probably this question that keeps me on my toes all the time. We have to work. Be helpful. We need to do something that really moves life forward.
— That's probably why you set a personal record in the bench press of 160 kg a few days ago.
— Do you remember the "Pumping Car" program? There, in one issue, televisions were built into the car directly into the bumpers. And the presenter asked the mechanic, "Why did you do that?" The answer was very simple: "Because I can." I really liked this answer then. I guess I have a similar story now.
At some point, the coach suggested trying to increase the weight. We tried, and it turned out that I was able to reap much more than I thought. Then there was progress. And now, by the age of almost 50, he had set a personal best. Although, it would seem, with my number of injuries and my employment, what records can there be? But now I'm already starting to think: maybe it will be possible to fulfill the standard of the master of sports in bench press. And this idea inspires me very much.
— If we talk about your main professional dream?
— I would really like the Russian circus to become a full-fledged competitor to the largest global companies, primarily the Canadian circus. To make it a worthy rivalry. We have long proved our competitiveness in the domestic market. In the Soviet Union, it was a whole government program. The Beryozka Ensemble, the Bolshoi Theatre, the Russian Opera, and the Soviet circus were known all over the world. Then a lot was lost. To some extent, we stopped doing it ourselves. That is why today it is both my dream and my task.
— I know that you once dreamed of elephants. Now you have seven of them. Who else would you like to put in the circus?
— Now everything depends not so much on desire, but on opportunities. In order for new animals to appear, an appropriate infrastructure is needed. In addition, there are many restrictions associated with the acquisition of certain types. For example, Vasily Timchenko, who works with northern sea lions, can no longer bring new animals from nature. Because of this, there is a problem of closely related breeding. The animals are already related, but you can't separate them either — they take it hard.
Therefore, it is necessary to update the population, but it is becoming increasingly difficult to do this. Or take polar bears. As far as I know, there are only three polar bears left in the entire world circus today. And all of them are located in Russia. And already at a rather advanced age. To be honest, I've always wanted to work with polar bears.
Переведено сервисом «Яндекс Переводчик»
