"Fedorishchev's statements need to be verified."

The outgoing year of 2024 was a difficult one for Russian soccer referees. The head of the RFU refereeing department Milorad Mazhich, as well as Pavel Kamantsev, the chairman of the RFU Refereeing Committee and Expert Refereeing Commission (EJC), were often criticized by RPL clubs. And in November, a scandal was added after Samara Region Governor Vyacheslav Fedorishchev claimed that an employee of Krylia Sovetov asked him for 36 million rubles to pay a debt to a certain person who allegedly controls the Russian referee corps.

In an interview with Izvestia Pavel Kamantsev commented on the situation with the statements of the head of the region, responded to the claims of the clubs that the ESC almost always takes the side of referees when analyzing their high-profile decisions, as well as assessed the situation with the disqualification of Vladislav Bezborodov for scandalous comments in Telegram, explained the reasons for the crisis of Sergey Karasev, spoke about the prospects of Vera Opeikina and told how he feels about the practice of hiring former referees to work in clubs.

- How did you react to Vyacheslav Fedorishchev's November statements about referees and the alleged debt of 36 million rubles?

- I have already said and I can repeat: we can not ignore such statements. They need to be checked. As you know, the law enforcement agencies are already conducting a check, I have already been questioned on this subject. Personally, I have nothing to hide, but I have no right to give such comments until the verification is completed. When the case comes to an official decision - initiation of criminal proceedings or refusal to initiate criminal proceedings - then I will give all necessary comments. In any case, I am ready to provide any assistance, if necessary.

- Nevertheless, you said a few weeks ago that the RFU is conducting its own audit of the refereeing of Krylia Sovetov matches over the past two years.

- It has already been completed. Now all the information is being summarized. We will provide the analysis to the law enforcement authorities on December 25-26.

- Have you ever encountered situations when club officials approached you with statements similar to those made by Fedorishchev?

- It has happened. The clubs know that I am open and ready to listen to anyone. And certainly the RFU Referee Committee will not ignore such complaints. Another thing is that we must always clearly understand where there are real grounds for this, and where there are just emotions, caused, for example, by the defeat of your team in the last match. If you remember, at one time, in 2022, we conducted an inspection of the Khimki vs. Krylya Sovetov game. And as a result of that inspection Alexei Matyunin is no longer working as a referee, because the RFU expert-judging commission found signs of biased refereeing with two key decisions. So, as you can see, the RFU does not ignore signals of this kind. Another thing is that we should always clearly check how well-founded these signals are.

- For more than a year, the RPL and clubs have continued to attack the referee corps and its management. In particular, the ESC is constantly criticized for the fact that it almost always supports referees when assessing their controversial decisions. What can you object to this?

- This is inherent in the function of the ESC. Because a referee is a person who makes decisions on the field, often very, very difficult ones. And if there are reasons to believe that such a decision is acceptable, we do it. There is nothing criminal about it. If the referee is not at the monitor, but works on the field, close to the moment, then from his point of view may be a different perception of the episode. The whole world understands this, so they agree with the decisions of referees, if they can find an explanation for them. And there is nothing wrong with that.

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- So, the ESC recognizes the referee's decision as wrong only in case of very obvious mistakes?

- Well, I can't say that they are completely obvious. But if there is a gray zone, when, conditionally speaking, the opinions of experts can be divided in the proportions of 55 to 45, then we believe that the referee had the right to make such a decision. In addition, we must take into account the nature of the match and the level of combat. That is, the ESC does not consider episodes in isolation from the whole match. If the referee allowed a high level of fights during the match and two teams fought hard, it is one level of refereeing and sanctions. As, for example, in the case of Fakel and Dinamo Makhachkala, who always give heat and fight hard.

And if we watch a match between two more playing teams, the number of fights and clashes is different. And the approach to refereeing is different. And if in a match we give cards for the smallest fouls from the first minutes, then these teams may not finish the game. Or take almost any derby of top clubs: if you start giving yellow cards right away, the teams, fans, journalists will complain to the referees: "You don't let them play, you put the players on cards!". And the golden mean, which will suit everyone, will never be found here. If you take out cards - you do not let them play, if you do not take out cards - you organize a massacre. And any fan can turn any decision of the referee against his team after the match, based on his emotions and sympathies. That's why ESC gives negative assessments to referees only when it is impossible to interpret certain episodes differently.

- There is no feeling that the clubs with their criticism and ideas to reform refereeing just want to return control over the appointment of referees, as it was in the 2000s?

- The clubs probably want that. At least, individual clubs do. But it is impossible. As long as I am in my current position, it will not happen.

- When Roberto Rosetti headed the RFU Refereeing and Inspection Department in 2011-2013, one of his key achievements was that he brought the system of appointing referees in line with UEFA norms, eliminating the influence of league representatives on appointments.

- We are still following Rosetti's case. He can be satisfied. (Smiles.)

- Is this your personal position, and not just a desire to fulfill UEFA standards?

- Well, how will the clubs influence it? All 16 clubs at once? Or individual representatives of the league?

- Before Rosetti's reform, there was one representative of the RPL in the commission for appointing referees.

- So whose interests did he represent? All 16 clubs at once? Let's say we have a match between Spartak and Zenit. Whose interests would this representative represent? I personally do not understand. That is why I consider this situation pointless. In my opinion, the current refereeing management system allows us to take into account the interests of everyone, including clubs. And I am always ready to listen to suggestions to improve the quality of work of referees, all claims. The main thing is that the dialog and criticism should be constructive.

- Stanislav Sukhina has recently returned to Lokomotiv, becoming the head of the youth team. How do you feel about the practice of former referees working in clubs?

- We treat it very well. It's just that we have a ban for those who worked in clubs. For at least two years after the end of their work in clubs, they are not allowed to work in the RFU refereeing bodies because of a conflict of interest.

- They can't work as inspectors for two years either?

- Yes. But this is precisely due to the fact that during this time the conflict of interest should be weathered, as they call it.

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- It seemed that this practice has recently started to wane.

- Well, why has it started to wane? For example, Mikhail Khodyrev, a former referee, worked at Spartak. After that, he didn't work anywhere for two years. And then he started working in the Moscow Football Federation.

- I meant that the practice of employing referees in clubs has decreased. The same Khodyrev left Spartak in 2021. At the same time, Sukhina was fired from Loko. It seemed that this was the result of your and Khachaturianz's informal recommendation to clubs to stop employing former referees. And there were fewer notable cases.

- You think so wrongly. In many clubs, for some reason, former referees are very valued as team bosses. The same Sukhina was quickly employed at Veles and Fakel. The thing is that we have nothing against such practice. I repeat, former referees should be prepared that after working in clubs they won't be able to work in the RFU refereeing bodies for two years.

- In the outgoing year there was an unpleasant story, when in spring the head coach of Enisey Andrey Tikhonov criticized the refereeing of Vera Opeikina at one of the matches of the First League and expressed his dissatisfaction with the practice of appointing a woman for such games, after which he received a five-match disqualification from the RFU CDC. Are you satisfied with the way that incident ended?

- I don't comment on the decisions of the RFU's jurisdictional bodies, be it the CDC or the Appeals Committee that upheld the disqualification. I can only say that Tikhonov's statement upset me a little bit. Among other things, because at that time in one of the rounds in the First League there was a poor quality refereeing by a male referee and there were no such statements against him. And those statements by Andrey Valerievich were inappropriate precisely because of the focus on whether the match was refereed by a woman or not. We do not and should not divide referees by gender.

- Was it not initially a risk to appoint Opeikin to referee that match?

- This is just a referee who has certain qualifications. If she works in the RPL on VAR, why can't she work as a referee at a First League match? Especially that Enisey match did not have a grand tournament significance.

- And how did the ESC evaluate her work in that game in general?

- Specialists, who evaluated the refereeing in that particular match, said that yes, one yellow card was given for nothing. Yes, it is certainly a mistake. But is it a reason for a wide discussion? Especially if this card did not affect anything, including further disqualification of the player.

- How did Opeikina herself survive that story?

- In fact, very easily and at ease. I think it was unpleasant for her to some extent, but since she had the full support of her colleagues, this topic was forgotten quite quickly by the next match.

- How would you assess her prospects in men's soccer?

- I think at the moment it's more League One with some separate assignments for RPL or Russian Cup matches involving RPL teams. To say that she is now ready to referee in the Premier League on a permanent basis is still impossible, and then everything depends on her. You have to understand that her appointment is not some kind of PR-action or a desire to prove that women can referee men's competitions. All the appointments that Vera has received are solely a consequence of her qualifications. She works very hard on VAR in the RPL. In addition, this person received an appointment last year for the official match between the national teams of Armenia and Kazakhstan in the UEFA Women's UEFA Nations League. The only Russian referee who has worked at an international competition after 2022.

- So her appointments for matches in the First League and RPL are not some kind of experiment?

- Exactly. That match between Enisey and Khabarovsk was just loud because of the statements of the head coach. But Vera has refereed games of this level before. And no one mentioned it. Perhaps the excitement was only last year in Kaliningrad, when she refereed the match between Baltika and Krylya Sovetov in the Russian Cup, making her debut at the match of RPL teams. Then she was presented with flowers, a lot was said and written about it. And then, until that episode with Tikhonov, we didn't hear much about her, her officiating was perceived as mundane, which is the best advertisement for Vera. It means that she works well and receives assignments not artificially.

- And physically she can withstand such a level?

- I will tell you that in the tests at the training camp her score was higher than some men. Of course, we don't have athletics, so good physical fitness doesn't mean you're ready to judge at the appropriate level. But at least it shows that there are no limitations to the work. Next comes the question of the level of decision making, game management, etc. It is premature to say that Vera has reached the level of the RPL in this respect, but everything may change with time.

- What happened to the male referees, whose performance was worse than Opeikina's?

- They are refereeing less than they could. Not only because of comparisons with Vera. We must understand that Majic is very fanatical about physical fitness. That's why all the judges have lost kilograms and increased muscle mass.

- Do you allow Vladislav Bezborodov to return to refereeing RPL matches after his disqualification?

- Everything that is allowed by the RFU regulations, he can realize. There are no restrictions and pitfalls. Yes, he was suspended from refereeing until the end of this season. It's not about the fact that he wrote something in Telegram. It's about the fact that he misled the commission, claiming that it was not his account, that someone else signed his name and made the corresponding entries. And the regulations prescribe strict sanctions for misleading - from six months to two years of disqualification. We provided the commission with evidence that Bezborodov wrote it. And since he eventually did not appeal the decision on disqualification, we can call it an indirect confirmation of our rightness.

- Sergei Karasev's officiating is often criticized this season, some of his decisions were recognized as erroneous by the ESC. What happened to him?

- No referee, no athlete, no person can work for a long period of time with the same, very good quality. When there are fluctuations, our task is to bring him back to the previous, high level. Now, yes, the level has slightly decreased, but I think that Sergei will rest, get in good shape and spend the spring part as before - at a high level.